Undine: Where did you get the name Saturn from, when did you decide on it?
Saturn: I always knew Saturn was the name I wanted to take on. Before I decided on it, I thought about how I wanted my signature to look like. I knew it had to be easy to recognize. I did not want it to be just a simple letter, but an emblem. I draw it out as a circle and a slash through it. And so my signature is a direct representation of the planet. (fig 1)
U: That’s so cute that you considered the signature, haha.
S: I love thinking about those little details. Before entering the industry I knew I wanted to establish my branding in the very beginning. The dungeon was the first place where I activated that name. It was also the testing ground to see if I felt like Saturn.
S: What about you?
U: The name I first used at the dungeon Nova took a bit of searching to arrive at. I had a whole list of names I was playing with. The process of finding one was really fun. In retrospect, I think Nova was very fitting for where I started my Pro Domme journey. I was starry eyed and had galactic silvery blonde hair. Even the etymology of the word Nova means “New” in Latin. The world of Pro Domming was so new to me. And so Nova served me while I was there until I was ready to move on from her.
S: How funny that both our names were celestial beings?
U: Haha, yeah I know right?
S: You’ve changed your name to Undine. And so, can you talk about how you got to Undine?
U: Yeah, I honestly don't remember where I came across the name. I think I came across it by chance during the process of rebranding myself as an independent Domme. And it just stood out, it felt original. It’s a name that carries its own folklore to it, but at the same time it’s not as weighted a name as if I had chosen, say Venus or Artemis or some more known entity in the Western zeitgeist. It’s mysterious, but still rooted in mythology (which I’m a bit of a nerd about). I was reflecting on the Goddess archetype, and I felt it didn’t resonate with me as much. Undine- she is not a God, but she is not mortal. She’s a liminal creature, and I think that meshes with my personality pretty well.
S: What is Undine? Where does the name Undine originate from?
U: Undine is a kind of water deity that comes from European folklore, like a water nymph (fig 2). I am forever attracted to the monstrous feminine and this idea that something outwardly beautiful and innocent seeming can be dark, powerful, even lethal if desired. In essence- I’m drawn to beings that are more than they appear to be. I myself am quite petite, and in spite of my longstanding twisted desires, it took me a while to realize I was Dominant because so many people looked at me- my height, my soft spokenness, and would assume that I was incapable. So I’ve come to find strength in playing with perception.
S: Do you think you changed when you switched from Nova to Undine? Names are very powerful and can change you, so I’m wondering if there was a shift when you changed your name?
U: Yes, I think it was mostly that I understood myself better as a Domme at that point, and how I wanted to present myself.
U: Did you feel you always knew your Domme persona and that was why Saturn was easy for you to choose?
S: Yes. I always loved astrology and the mythologies behind them. I closely follow the movements and transitions of astrological signs in the heavenly bodies, especially the moon phases. I am an advocate for my sign, Capricorn (fig 3 & fig 4). This beast is a mythical creature that has the body of a goat and a tail of a fish. It is an animal that can live on land and sea. That duality speaks to me and my experience as an Asian-American. Neither here or there, this or that, but both simultaneously. Capricorn is ruled by Saturn, which is considered the task maker and ruler of rules. I always live by my rules and I encourage my clients to follow them. As an iconic symbol, Saturn is associated with boundaries, limitations, discipline, death, Daddy/masculine energy. What Saturn represents is everything I love and am still currently learning to fully embrace. That is the story of my life journey. I want to take on those characteristics and grow into them. I was brought up in a very traditional and religious household. I was conditioned to be very feminine, very soft, and constantly told I had to sacrifice my boundaries for others. I think there is so much I can learn from this icy planet. I want to explore Saturn’s themes in playful and mystical ways. And so during my Saturn return I am learning to become Saturn.
U: So funnily enough the Capricorn goat is kind of similar to Undine - two liminal creatures trapped between two worlds.
S: Yes, I feel like Undine and Saturn are both isolated figures in their stories. Saturn literally eats his children which ultimately makes him end up alone.
U: yes Undine is isolated as well. Her story closely mirrors the tragic Little Mermaid story by #queericon Hans Christian Anderson- himself an outsider.
U: You mentioned that Saturn is associated with Death? I love that. Can you elaborate more on that?
S: Depends on which philosopher you read, but Saturn’s name is derived from the Latin word satis, which means “Time”. Time consumes all things. (fig 5) Hence its relation to Death.
U: Huh, I didn’t know that. That’s so interesting.
S: Yeah and in the Tarot deck, the Death card, number 13, is ruled by Saturn. Death is not an ending to me, but a new beginning. In all this symbolism, I think it’s another reason why it makes sense to be veiled. Death is someone that you don’t really know the face of, until you meet them. (fig 6)
U:That’s right. Even Saturn the planet itself is obscured by its rings.
S: Yes. The rings are a representation of boundaries. All of its visual components are related. Again, I am just obsessed with the meaning that Saturn represents.
U: I’m also attracted to Death and I feel like that is why we get along so well. I would also agree with you that Death is about renewal. The way I’ve always tried to make sense of Death is as a kind of transformation.
S: We naturally have a gravitational pull toward each other. Also the fact that you are also from the Bay Area. And I don’t think I ever met anyone from SF/Bay Area. It’s not often I bump into people from CA. When I do they are usually from LA.
U: I noticed that too while I was in New York. Another coincidence, or perhaps it was written in the stars.